Overdubbing

No replies
gaudencio
User offline. Last seen 4 years 45 weeks ago. Offline
Joined: 2009-06-02
Posts:

OK, this is really embarrassing, since I've been using ardour for a year and a half yet it's a beginners question. Anyway, basically, I used to do overdubbing with track layers, but now explicit layering has been removed. Probably for the best, you know what you're doing, but, as far as I can see now my only option to do over dubs the way I used to is to create a new track. That's OK, but I really don't want masses of extra tracks, so what I was hoping to do is to keep a "scratch" track for recording my overdubs transparently and getting them in time with the main track, then somehow bouncing them to the track I want. So my real question then is how do I copy my new region in the scratch track, to the main track, without losing the positioning.
#####edit#####
ok, I just tried something....dragging with middle click to the old track - works like a dream. Trial and error is the best teacher. However, I'm still going to ask the question as I'm sure this is probably not the best procedure for recording overdubs.
So my modified question is how do you all go about recording overdubs? I have to confess the most accurate/best sounding overdubs I've ever done were years ago with audacity, because it;s destructive nature just seemed to fit in with my way of thinking - I'd zoom right in as far as I could to the wave form and line it up beautifully. I'm sure this sort of thing must be possible in ardour, but I've not managed it yet.

Final note since it's my first post, I must get it down for the record - ardour is truly incredible, one of the best open source projects around.

seablade
User offline. Last seen 33 min 46 sec ago. Offline
Joined: 2007-01-22
Posts:

So my modified question is how do you all go about recording overdubs? I have to confess the most accurate/best sounding overdubs I've ever done were years ago with audacity, because it;s destructive nature just seemed to fit in with my way of thinking - I'd zoom right in as far as I could to the wave form and line it up beautifully. I'm sure this sort of thing must be possible in ardour, but I've not managed it yet.

If you want a destructive overdub, look at Tape tracks.

However that being said, I am surprised layering isn't working for you. I ahve to look into it, but I didn't think that had been removed for any reason I know of.

And another option you might want to look at is playlists. Create a new playlist for each take on a track and see if that works for you.

Seablade

gaudencio
User offline. Last seen 4 years 45 weeks ago. Offline
Joined: 2009-06-02
Posts:

ok, well I've been playing around a bit, using a separate track to record on, then moving the region into the main track with the middle mouse button and playing with crossfades and stuff. Pretty good results, no clicks, good enough that the casual listener wouldn't notice, but could be improved, so I'd still love to hear how the experts on this forum do overdubs. It's a single acoustic guitar, on it's own, trying to get a perfect sounding performance (yeah, I know I should just practice more...)

As for where the layers went, I have no idea. I'm on ardour 2.8. I remember when I first started they were really obvious, then they disappeared but could still be enabled with right click on a track, now in 2.8 I can't find them anywhere at all, but I think I prefer this method any way - layers are too messy

the C.L.A.
the C.L.A.'s picture
User offline. Last seen 1 week 5 days ago. Offline
Joined: 2006-12-03
Posts:

First you could check wich layering mode suits your needs best (Options -> Layering). For editing I usually use "Later is Higher", but for Overdubbing "Most Recently Added is Higher" might be better in some scenarios.

The second thing is, that if you usually don't move regions along the timeline a lot, you could select "Lock Edit" instead of "Slide Edit" from the dropdown box in the upper left corner. This kind of reverses the normal behaviour: You can't accidentally move regions along the timeline while editing with buttons 1 and 2 but are able to do it explicitly with the middle mouse button.

And as Seablade said: Don't miss to check out the possibilities that playlists offer. I wouldn't bother creating and recording into a new track but simply use "New Copy" from the playlists menu and then record overdubbs into the same track (possibly using Punch In/Out function) or use "New" to do a whole new take. This way you can easily switch between playlists to compare different Takes/Overdubbs/Edits etc...

philicorda
User offline. Last seen 1 year 45 weeks ago. Offline
Joined: 2006-05-16
Posts:

Using scratch tracks is a great way of working. Another way that I've got in the habit of using over the last few years is this...

For a vocal track, I set up three or so tracks, route them to a bus and set up the compression/eq/level etc on the bus. Then I mute/unmute sections of the tracks (different takes of the same vocal line) as I need them.

This way, I don't need to use lanes, playlists, or compile the takes into a single track, to hear new edits with the vocal+effects in the context of the mix.

When it comes to the final mix I sometimes tidy things up, but more often leave the vocal parts spread out over a few tracks, and just hide the tracks. The group fader then is all I need to think about.

I find it faster to work this way, and easier to visually see which bits of which take are being used.

Tracks/busses are cheap in Ardour, so I tend to use them extravagantly. Just don't try working like this on a PT TDM system as you can run out of routing slots. :)

gaudencio
User offline. Last seen 4 years 45 weeks ago. Offline
Joined: 2009-06-02
Posts:

thanks for the replies. Just checked quickly, can't seem to find playlists in ardour 2.8. I remember seeing them before in the right tabs, I think, but I never used them. Either way, I think actually the scratch track method seems simplest for me at the minute, so I'm going to keep on with that. I find productivity diminishes very sharply with complexity. I end up twiddling buttons too much. Any plans for a CLI version of ardour? Now THAT would be something to boast to the protools boys about.

paul
paul's picture
User offline. Last seen 9 hours 31 min ago. Offline
Joined: 2006-03-16
Posts:

@gaudencio: playlists are accessed via the "p" button on each track header.

there was a CLI version of ardour 7 years ago. it is no longer supported, and is hardly likely to be something that any conventional PT user would find impressive. it was sponsored by and developed for sight-impaired users, and had many innovative features that are hard to fit into a GUI paradigm.