Suggestions for Windows Laptop and Linux Desktop working together

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Steele
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hello forum folks,

I'm looking forward to change my win-only system to a linux system(Ubuntu or maybe Ubuntu-Studio) to do my audio work.
I'm sampling and using recording sometimes, so I think Ardour, despite from it looks and ambitions, is a pretty exchange for Logic5.5 which I now use.

With my Desktop Computer I think there are no problems: hardware (MAudio Audiophile 2469) is supported and thats just fine.

But for recording I normally use my laptop, because its portable and I'm making no studio-recordings but "roomy" recordings, which pretty fits the music I'm recording (another story).
My portable soundcard is a MAudio Firewire 410, which is not supported by any linux system, afaik. Thats a problem and I can't do anything against it. So Linux on my laptop is not possible, like it looks. I'm stuck to Windows.

I know there are acutally no real and high-priority attempts to port Ardour to Windows, ok, I can understand this and its ok.

But now I have to find a solution: Recording on Windows and then getting the recorded data, which can be many tracks, maybe already cut (but without effects) to Ardour to make further editing.
Do you have any suggestions how I can manage this? As I mentioned, Logic5.5 for Windows is avaible, but I'm fine with switching to other software, but this has to be free (I'm sure you all can understand this).

I searched trough the forums and the manual and I see there is no import for logic project files. I can imagine that this format is binary and Emagic/Apple has not opened this format. Sad, but not changeable.

Can you think of other ways how I can get my Windows Projectfiles to Ardour (or do you know aFirewire410 driver... not? ok)

Greetings from my first posting and I'm looking forward to join the Ardour Community to do some professional Audiostuff with OpenSource Software.

Nils "Steele" Gey,
Germany (currently India)

nowhiskey
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hi,
i think, if your laptop has digi-out´s and your desktop has digi-in´s (adat), you can play 8 files at the same time into linux 1:1?

cheers,
doc

Steele
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Of course, an analog solution is alway possible. I could just bounce every track and copy the wave files and importing/embedding them. But both solutions will take a lots of time. So I would prefer a pure digital way.

Havoc
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What about an USB device for recording on the laptop? There are some supported ones. The 410 is only 2 channel, so that isn't a problem for USB.

Steele
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So I'm searching for a software solution, because hardware cost much money :)

breakerfall
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I think the answer you're looking for might be in this thread:

http://ardour.org/node/699

if you use Broadcast WAVE as the format in Nuendo (which is always a good idea if the session might need to be portable), then each file will have an internal timeline position recorded in it. Ardour 2.0 will align them correctly if you *embed* them (not import).

If you do not use Broadcast WAVE, then it will be a lot harder to get them all aligned.

So... apparently, as long as the software you use to record can use Broadcast Wave format, then it should be okay if you embed. Of course, you need to use Ardour2. =]

Hope that helps.

Steele
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Ah, that sounds fine. Tomorrow I fly back to Germany and have my Computer back, I will try it then and share my experience with you.

jburtner
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Production Workflow Solution:

You can also put into place the following workflow so that you can easily exchange audio files between any workstation platform:

-1-
Use your system(s) of choice to record/edit and process audio.

-2-
If the system uses a region based architecture, once you are happy with your edits, and arrangements bounce that particular track/channel to disk to create a dedicated WAV file that is the length of the song from beginning to end. That then becomes your MASTER_XXX for that particular instrument or channel.

-3-
If you need to edit that MASTER_XXX later you can either go back to the session where you created it, and go from there or pick up with editing the MASTER_XXX. Either way, create another MASTER_XXX to move forward with.

-4-
Along the way through your production create submixes of the MASTER_XXX so that you can import/embed those into your new overdub sessions. That will keep your overdub sessions simpler and more focused. Once you are happy with that particular overdub commit that track(s) to your MASTER_SESSION by creating another contiguous WAV and importing that into your MASTER_SESSION.

-5-
As you go along, create various sub mixes and stems of your MASTER's for overdubs. This will also give you time to experiment with different mix strategies for your final.

-5.1-
If you are using virtual instruments / midi, then convert that to a WAV when you are satisfied with the performance and go back for editing later if needed.

-6-
When using different systems you can just import the sub-mixes/stems and snap all of them to the beginning of the session. Set the channel faders to 0, and go from there.

-7-
The amount of disk space you have available will dictate how many versions you can actually save but when you get to the final-mix it will be well organized.

-8-
Another benefit of having all contiguous files at final-mix is that the CPU resources will be maximized for mix processing instead of playing virtual instruments. If there is silence in certain areas on certain files, that is fine too. It is easier on the system to stream data from a single contiguous file that have the HDD heads jump all over the place for region edits and such. This will end up with the ability to playback more channels @ mix and dedicate more CPU to EQ's and other processing.

In your situation it may be a matter of discretely bouncing each channel to disk in logic. You can then access a SMB share and copy the files over to your Ardour box as you create more MASTER_XXX's.

Hope that helps!

Cheers,
jonathan

Steele
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So... a bit experience sharing...

I am running Ubuntu Studio with a Maudio 2469 on my Desktop and everything is fine.
But:
Still the laptop runs windows. And I still have the MAudio Firewire 410

My goal is, of course, to have the same software running on both systems. As you can imagine I prefer Ardour.

I've tried a few things...

-Contacting the FFado/Freebob people regarding drivers for the F410: Failed. There is no hardware for testing and no real motivation for this kind of buggy device.

-This is barely legal and I failed so I tell you nevertheless: Installing an hacked OSX 10.4.x on my laptop to run both the device and ardour. Laptop not compatible.

-I considered this, but for obvious reasons I did not try this: Some Emulator on my windowslaptop to run Ardour...

-Finding a program to record in windows and copy it to ardour: Not statisfied. If you know a program which is good for this please tell me.

So in the end I must say it is this damn 410. The only way out of this getting a full ardour-powererd mobile recording system is: money. To buy a new sounddevice. Sadly its not there.

Good night

mark0978
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If you know how to code you could put together an ASIO recorder for your laptop. Use Libsndfile to write the WAV files and all will be OK. Since you are only doing a few channels it will keep up ok (but don't try to record more than 8 or you will overrun your buffers, been there done that) Laptops and large through put are mutually exclusive things.

Then, import the data into Ardour.

Alternately, you might be able to use Audacity on Windows to do the record, export the file as wav, and load that into Ardour. I'm just not sure about the support for the MAudio device with Ardour and with more than one channel, however I know Audacity can do stereo.

Really anthing that can make a wav file should do. Ardour uses libsndfile for import.....

daniq
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What I would preferably do, is program linux drivers for the 410. Actually, I've never made such a complicated program... But I'd give it a try. You see - Mac is a UNIX-based system, so maybe it's drivers could be your startpoint on this crusade.

Or, maybe the Win drivers could give you the How-the-hell-this-works answer. Maybe (please, don't stone me :o] not really experienced with emulators ;oP ) you could run the Win drivers on Wine or something like that..

**PEACE**

Steele
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Oh, the "edit" button just creates a new answer? ...
If you can, please delete the doublepost.

Since I have a new soundcard there is no reason for a workaround. I'm a friend of "complete or nothing", or something like this; don't know how the term is in english.

kevinkanak
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Cubase is a relatively inexpensive software for windows that I am pretty sure works with the 410 and it records wave files as well. Im pretty sure they get timestamped so unless Im wrong about Ardour, it should place everything you load in to the correct timestamp.

sinsect
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I'm kind of in the same boat as steele...

I want to go linux (probably in the ubuntu family), but the brick wall is my firewire 410. this is my only audio interface, and i've dumped way too much money into my current setup to replace it.

i don't know anything about code, i just make pretty pictures and noises...

theotrst
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hi
i have the same problem to change 410 into other device...I thought "focusrite saffire LE" that could be comparable with firewire 410...but in freebob they write: "FireWire Interface with DSP - DSP and mixer not supported by FreeBob"

so... :-O

any idea?

Steele
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There are some firewire devices. I just looked at the freebob and ffado website and looked through the lists.

There is no chance with the 410. If you don't have a bus analyzer hardware and driver-programming skills then just sell it. I went 2 months through this thoughts.

mark0978
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Presonus Firepod Works Great

The Presonus Firepod is a wonderful unit in my opinion. It's $400, gives you 10 inputs (8 preamps and 2 S/PDIF). If you need more channels, you can gang 3 of them together (at which point the S/PDIF is deactivated so you only get 24 channels).

I'm using 4 of them in Capture only mode with Jack. I also have an M-Audio 1814 (if any one wants to buy it :-) but I'm doing all my recording on the firepod. If you pick it up from sweetwater, you can try it for 30 days and if it doesn't cut it for you, send it back.

I never got the saffire 26 unit to work, had to send it back before I could figure it out.